#foswiki 2011-08-23,Tue

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WhoWhatWhen
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harlanso is there a way to have foswiki send at least some emails to people encrypted?
I'm thinking about password resets and stuff.
I want someothing similar for wordpress.
And also on my wishlist is to get egroupware to use FW as its wiki engine.
[02:11]
gac410Harlan, I've added some patches to 1.1.4 (unreleased) to send email with S/MIME. But it does signing, not encryption.
To send encrypted, you would need the cert of the recipient - so probably a significant effort to deal with that.
[02:12]
harlanyup, and we can either attach those to a FW-local keyring (makes sense) or expect the user to upload their key. [02:15]
gac410The other problem will be how to handle that FW will email to multiple recipients - like change notices, etc. We'd have to add a separate function that handles password reset emails separately. [02:19]
Looks like Crypt::SMIME function will do encryption. So it's a matter of adding the certificate store and a path to send encrypted. But probably not real simple. Currently it expects the cert to be stored in an external cert file.
If managing certs for a large number of users, probably best to store certs externally in LDAP ... or ??
[02:24]
harlanI wish I knew - I just know I could really use this for FW, wordpress, bugzilla, ...
and it woudl be great if we could find a way to have a single "package" do this.
[02:26]
gac410I don't know anything at all about wordpress or bugzilla. Hmm could a server based solution like http://www.djigzo.com/ do anything for you? [02:31]
harlanharlan looks.
interesting - thanks!
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[06:15]
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foswiki_irc7Some of the users are getting "504 Gateway timeout" error when trying to access some pages not all the pages...
can you please let me know what may be the reason of the issue??
[06:28]
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foswiki_irc7some users having the same issue when try to create the new topic... [06:29]
harlanI suspect a FreeBSD port upgrade of foswiki just toasted my LocalSite.cfg and .htpasswd files...
not yet sure what else might be missing...
[06:37]
mrintegrityhi all, almost got my employer happy to go with foswiki instead of confluence but they want to know the hardware requirements.. we would be running it virtual on esxi 4.1 and i'm thinking a dual core virtual cpu with 2 / 4 G ram.. we have a couple of hundred users total.. perhaps 20 symultanious
i couldn't find any hardware requirements documented
does anyone have any advice on the requirements?
[06:46]
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pharveymrintegrity: Foswiki is a little heavier than confluence. 20 simultaneous users - actually, could you say in terms of requests per minute/hour? We run our site on a single-core 4GB VM, and with the experimental MongoDBPlugin disabled, it struggles with 450 hits/hr
not to mention: will you be building wiki apps which use SEARCHes in large sets of documents (some pages building very complex reports contribute to the slow-down on our wiki)
[07:16]
mrintegritypharvey: hmm ok, thought confluence would be heavier. I don't know how many hits per min/hour it will be. 400 is not unthinkable though
400 per hour
pharvey: there won't be any complex report generating
but there were quite a few plugins i was planning to install
[07:18]
pharveyand how many topics (roughly?) I mean - dual-core VM is probably okay, you'll want the 4GB RAM though (to avoid hitting slow disk) [07:19]
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mrintegritythe topics will increase all the time.. a couple of hundred after a month probably [07:21]
pharveyfoswiki_irc7: sounds like Foswiki is taking too long to serve some requests. Are you accessing Foswiki from behind a proxy?
we have ~200k topics, but we're running an experimental build of Foswiki :)
[07:21]
mrintegritywe would also access foswiki via HA Proxy btw.. hopefully thats straight forwward though as it's just apache [07:22]
pharveycool.
I'd suggest E-mailing the foswiki-discuss mailing list for more experienced answers
[07:22]
mrintegritypharvey: is that experimental in a "nasa scramjet" kind of way or more of a "different kind of tracktor" :? :)
thanks I will do that
[07:22]
pharveywe run the trunk version from svn in production, coupled with MongoDBPlugin (which replaces Foswiki's default search & query algorithms)
we do a lot of heavy reporting stuff
[07:23]
mrintegrityok
maybe i will just setup a test system on the quiet and see how it feels
[07:23]
pharveyexcellent idea
our VMs performed terribly, initially
[07:23]
mrintegrityesx? [07:23]
pharveythen they upgraded the hardware, and it seems brilliant now
yes, ESX
[07:24]
mrintegritywe run esxi 4.1 with local disk only.. kinda sucks tbh
no vsphere
[07:24]
Babarmrintegrity: HA proxy? Problem is, what do you want to cache? Putting a varnish in front is always good if you serve the same content to hundreds of users, but tuning your cache (mod_expire mostly) helps a lot [07:24]
mrintegrityi am kinda pushing to test out some alternatives like kvm [07:24]
pharveywell, I'm quite removed from the details - I just have root access, and they take care of keeping it up :) [07:25]
mrintegrityoh ok :)
Babar: we don't do any caching
Babar: maybe a good idea though
[07:25]
Babarmrintegrity: mod_expires and mod_perl or any other kind of persistent perl is mandatory if you want to have decent performance [07:30]
pharveyabsolutely [07:30]
Babaror you have ridiculously fast hardware like we do on foswiki.org :) [07:30]
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[07:32]
pharveymrintegrity: Confluence is quicker at some things (like backlinks) because it's keeping track of that data in a database
that's what I meant by "heavier"
gotta run
[07:33]
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mrintegrityhmm
thanks for the help all
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SvenDowideitmmm, hopefully will have time to work tomorrow :/ [08:20]
MichaelDaumHi Sven
wrt GA: are all current foswiki assoc members supposed to be on the ML ... or do we contact them individually?
WikiRingBot, seen Oliver
[08:27]
WikiRingBotWikiRingBot has last seen OliverKrueger 20 Aug 2011 - 08:16 GMT on #foswiki [08:28]
SvenDowideitMichaelDaum: iirc last times we just emailed the discussion list
thou its not hard to email that small a group personally
my main focus has been to try to get enough feedback to set a date
[08:29]
MichaelDaumI am a bit worried looking at http://foswiki.org/Community/CurrentFoswikiMembers#Active_Members [08:30]
SvenDowideitwhen i get a little time, i'll email out a 'decision' and then make a poll
but thati'll be a few days time
the girls transition to 2 days day care is hard work
and I'm about 6weeks behind workwise
[08:30]
MichaelDaumBabar, for example. your column for 2011 is still empty ... payment missing? ;) [08:31]
SvenDowideiti'm actually more worried that there have been zero responses wrt boardmembers
so if nothing happens, there will be a board of 2
and we'll have to wind it all up
[08:31]
MichaelDaumwhats going on @ moto [08:31]
SvenDowideitpass [08:31]
BabarMichaelDaum: dunno. I think I paid 2 years last time, but I don't remember when somebody made me join the GA [08:32]
MichaelDaumBabar, we need yours and the voice of all other current members at http://foswiki.org/Community/AgendaThirdGeneralAssembly
Sven's email on the ml should have made that clear ;)
[08:32]
SvenDowideitlet alone my pissyness here on irc :p [08:33]
MichaelDaumLavr, are you still there? [08:33]
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BabarBabar said he'll organise it at CERN if possible when the date will be decided [08:34]
MichaelDaumHi ArthurClemens. As we are talking about it I've checked your 2011 at http://foswiki.org/Community/CurrentFoswikiMembers ... there's some missing? [08:34]
SvenDowideitBabar: i think we should treat the 18Nov dete as decided
i won't be able to come for more than the w/e
[08:35]
MichaelDaum19Nov you mean? [08:35]
SvenDowideitas it seems pam has deliverables all month
that w/e..
[08:35]
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SvenDowideitif i'm lucky, pam will be able to come with the girls and we can stay over there [08:36]
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SvenDowideitif not, i'll have to train it there and back for one day only
which will suck timewise, but thats life
[08:36]
mrintegrityI think i would like to join as an active member.. how do you i do that? [08:36]
MichaelDaumit would be xtra cool to get people together for 3 days: 18-20 Nov [08:36]
SvenDowideitit'd be cool - but it looks like it won't be my reality [08:37]
MichaelDaummrintegrity, whats your WikiName on foswiki.org? I'll add you to http://foswiki.org/Community/CurrentFoswikiMembers#Membership_Applications then.
this list will be decided on during the GA
SvenDowideit, FoswikiCamp topic: "shift to plack"
[08:37]
ArthurClemenshmm, didn't I pay? [08:38]
MichaelDaumArthurClemens, could you please check with Oliver? [08:39]
ArthurClemensyes [08:39]
MichaelDaum:) [08:39]
SvenDowideitatm, i'm going to be focussed on re-doing the store refactor for 2.0 :( [08:39]
MichaelDaum"make plack no plaque on foswiki"
just to have some positive msg
[08:40]
mrintegrityMichaelDaum: http://foswiki.org/Main/AlanMcGinlay [08:41]
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MichaelDaummrintegrity, kool. any few words what your connections to foswiki are? (company/user/enthusiast)
having it on your user page would be cool I guess :)
here's a template. hello, I am Alan and I love foswiki. cheers.
[08:42]
mrintegrityhmm.. dunno really, I used twiki before as an end user and liked the software, i like it even more now that it's Free.. I am also doing my best to get my employer to use it :P [08:43]
MichaelDaumokay. added you to the list. [08:44]
mrintegritytnx :) [08:45]
MichaelDaumhope to meet you on the upcoming http://foswiki.org/Community/AgendaThirdGeneralAssembly, either virtual or in R.L. [08:45]
SvenDowideitargh. apple broke vnc in lion :( [08:45]
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SvenDowideitall i want it to be able to x2vnc to control the current session
pharvey: I'm not sure that git per module makes much sense for the store refactor
[08:45]
mrintegritythink i could only attend virtually [08:46]
SvenDowideitas I basically need to grep all the code [08:46]
mrintegritydon't have any holidays this year :E [08:46]
pharveySvenDowideit: fair enough [08:46]
SvenDowideitto see what other author's do
mostly, it suites my main workflow to have all the code i can get my hands on
[08:46]
pharveykk [08:47]
SvenDowideitannoying and sad tho
big q
when you do it, are threre instructions on where things come from and how toset them?
SvenDowideit hasn't looked because, well, just because :/
[08:47]
pharveywhen I do what sorry? [08:48]
SvenDowideitif someone git clone core
then pseudo-install developer
black box being a bit daunting compared to i know where my source comes from
[08:48]
pharveyah, pseudo-install has a default repo list containing just github.com/foswiki. If you look at the instructions you get when running ./pseudo-install.pl without any opts it says more (basically: do ./pseudo-install.pl -G to generate a default repo list in ~/.buildcontrib that you can hack) [08:49]
BabarMichaelDaum: done. [08:50]
pharveyif it doesn't exist on the FS, it tries each repo in trun [08:50]
SvenDowideiter [08:50]
pharveyturn*
I'll let you know when it can work with submodules, which is when it will get properly interesting I think :)
[08:50]
SvenDowideitok, so the check out a new trunk using git, then install and enable an extension from [08:51]
pharveypseudo-install should also maintain a .gitignore of generated symlinks/gz's [08:51]
SvenDowideitdoc doesn't mention that [08:51]
pharveySvenDowideit: it's in the last 3 lines of doc [08:52]
SvenDowideitit probly could do with info that tells the user what it'll do
no
those lines are not telling me where its getting ./pseudo-install developer _from_
[08:52]
pharveythen read the 2nd paragraph of the intro [08:52]
SvenDowideiti can presume, but thats a tad scary [08:53]
pharveyoh, that's not the repo list
looks like I need to write more doc :)
[08:53]
SvenDowideiti see nothing about the repo
list
all i see is vauge references to 'if you don't know what it does, stay away'
:}
[08:53]
pharveypharvey looks for that reference [08:54]
SvenDowideiti suspect its already too many lines, and really needs a url to the full docco that no-one will read
mmm, only 500 actionable emails to go, and i'll be caught up :(
[08:54]
pharveyd'oh [08:55]
SvenDowideitArthurClemens: I'm frightened by your skin path change - because last time we tried to make it more logical, we broke some users apps :(
i'm going to hope that you've thought about the last war we had about it and move on, because i simply lack the time
[08:56]
ArthurClemensthat's why I committed, so we can notice [08:57]
SvenDowideitlast time it wasn't noticed until after release
i'd love to fix it further tho, but same applies, to many things i'm behind on
and now CDot and I have worked out what we need to do to fix the sotre for 2.0, there's even more
[08:57]
ArthurClemensthe only thing that may go wrong is that users have created a template topic and because it didn't work continued their work in /templates
with the update the template topic is now picked up earlier than the tmpl
[08:59]
SvenDowideittemplate topic only in System I hope? [09:00]
ArthurClemensI haven't touched that code, so it should work as normal [09:04]
SvenDowideitas we have trust issues with open web template topics
um, thats sounds hairy
as the code allows template topics in any web
but only those in System should be allowed to come before the templates/ dir
else a user can insert hacks into the skin that can be a big security risk
SvenDowideit is actually worried that even before your change, the way it works ismuch too insecure
[09:04]
ArthurClemensisn't that in the TemplatePath? [09:04]
SvenDowideitpoint is that when you change it, you need to make sure its still secure
cos that code is shit.
and so has previously had unexpected side effects
[09:04]
ArthurClemensI will have a look and test it [09:04]
SvenDowideitya :(
the best thing would be for us to simplify the entire thing, removing some entries in the path, ans some of the implied results
but thats another hairpuller
pharvey: I commited an initial re-write of Store.pm
much fewer entry methods
[09:04]
pharveycool :) [09:07]
SvenDowideithttps://github.com/SvenDowideit/foswiki/commit/a2994db581e679c697c5a503579f71dcb35c0fdf#diff-0 [09:08]
pharveypharvey looks0ring [09:08]
SvenDowideitthough in that version i combined load and create, and i think i'll separate them [09:08]
MichaelDaumBabar, thx [09:10]
Babaroh, so you forked it Sven? :) [09:10]
SvenDowideitBabar: y, i want to confirm that what i'm trying to do will work first [09:11]
BabarSven and pharvey, the only 2 to ever forked foswiki on github :) [09:11]
SvenDowideitsad innit
and closedwiki seems to have lost interest and stopped updating
[09:11]
BabarSvenDowideit: sad, yes, but my guess is that it's way too big to fork, which is why pharvey's idea to split the repo sounds good
harder to keep track, but doable
[09:14]
SvenDowideiti don't know about big, as its an almost instant operation to fork it :) [09:14]
ArthurClemensSvenDowideit: if the admin adds to {TemplatePath} the item: $Foswiki::cfg{UsersWebName}.$skinSkin$nameTemplate, the admin creates a security hole himself. Should we invalidate this by analysing the template path? [09:20]
SvenDowideitthta'd be a 'would be nice' - essentially by testing web's ACLs and raising a warning in configure
but its not as important as the defaults
as we need to look after the simple install and forgetters
[09:23]
ArthurClemensif the {TemplatePath} is not changed, you cannot just create a template topic in Main web [09:24]
SvenDowideitI really wish we didn't magically add the 'Template' bit on the end - its very confusing that one sets the name to a topic that does not exist, and then Template is appened
but thats another legacy :(
ArthurClemens: sweet
SvenDowideit has to go - laters
[09:24]
pharveypharvey found branching quick, but checking out branches & reset --hard much slower on the big-fat-trunk checkout [09:26]
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ModAcOstHi, how can a plugin best check, if a user exists? [09:57]
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pharveyModAcOst: Foswiki::Func::wikiToUserName returns undef if the wikiname is unknown [10:28]
FoswikiBothttp://trunk.foswiki.org/System/PerlDoc?module=Foswiki::Func [ (Foswiki login) PerlDoc ] [10:28]
ModAcOstOk, thank you! [10:28]
pharveynp [10:30]
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Alexander__Hi there, is there any possibility to use the RenderPlugin to render a template without rendering a complete page? (without head, body, and so on...)? [11:29]
MichaelDaumAlexander__, yes of course. thats one of its main purposes. [11:32]
Alexander__MichaelDaum, i just got it, that the template is rendered 1:1. So i have an other problem within the simplemodal dialog ;) [11:37]
ArthurClemensAlexander__: I thought you could pass an id of the element you want to show [11:50]
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Alexander__ArthurClemens: now it´s working. There have been several empty lines and p tags in the beginning of the template. simplemodal dialog was not able to render this as a dialog...
Does anyone here have experience with periodically upcoming tasks? (e.g. in the actiontracker)
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ArthurClemensI believe there is no way to noautolink an email address
except for <nop> in front
[12:49]
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ArthurClemensbut not with <noautolink> [12:52]
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pharveyArthurClemens: <literal>? [13:09]
ArthurClemenspharvey: thanks. to my surprise I can put the complete STARTFORM/ENDFORM inside literal tags and everything works
that is how long since I started with twiki?
[13:21]
pharveyI'm often second-guessing literal, noautolink and friends :( [13:22]
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Alexander__No experience with periodically upcoming tasks there...but perhaps anyone does have experience with dynamically changing dataforms? (I would like to change input values in dependency of other field values) [13:39]
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ArthurClemensdamned computer crashes [13:46]
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gac410ArthurClemens: Item11059 - trailing dot in a domain is technically correct from what I can tell - though probably useless. [14:27]
FoswikiBothttp://foswiki.org/Tasks/Item11059 [ Item11059: Email address followed by a dot generates email link with dot included ] [14:27]
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[14:27]
dawnbuiehi all - I'm wondering if there's a plugin or technique to hide parts of the wiki from google search? for instance I don't want it to spider the sandbox or system web
just robots.txt?
[14:28]
MartinRowedawnbuie: there is the global {AntiSpam}{RobotsAreWelcome} setting in configure otherwise it's down to robots.txt [14:39]
dawnbuieoh so with global {AntiSpam}{RobotsAreWelcome} i can set restrictions? [14:40]
MartinRoweThere is an example file in the root of the installation [14:40]
dawnbuieok i'll look - thanks
for robots you mean
[14:40]
MartinRoweyes
the configure value is an all-or-nothing setting, so probably not appropriate for what you're after
[14:42]
dawnbuiethanks [14:45]
Alexander__MichaelDaum: I´m just playing around with your SolrPlugin. Is it possible to provide an prefix or sufix to the search query ? e.g. i would like to add the "EN" suffix but it should be invisble for the user [14:47]
MichaelDaum? [14:47]
Alexander__I´m implementing a dropdown for choosing the topic language. The topiclanguage is not stored in a formfield but depends on the sufix -EN, -DE, etc. [14:50]
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uebera||Is it ok to use "Foswiki Association e.V." as receiver for SEPA money transfers (cf. http://www.foswiki.org/Community/Finance/WebHome)? (i.e., is this the official account holder?) /me must have missed the announcement ;)
Because in the table below it says "B-*OK*"
...and B-FW, w/o specifying that detail.
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