#foswiki 2015-09-03,Thu

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GithubBot[TreePlugin] gac410 tagged 1.93 at 1497313: http://git.io/vGDDW [00:41]
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GithubBot[distro] gac410 pushed 2 new commits to master: http://git.io/vGyk6
distro/master 04dca6d George Clark: Item13649: Preserve copyright and authors...
distro/master 9a92234 George Clark: Item13649: Handle more variations on copyright and authors...
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FoswikiBothttp://foswiki.org/Tasks/Item13649 [ Item13649: BuildContrib not properly copying copyright information releasing an extension ] [02:45]
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GithubBot[TreeBrowserPlugin] gac410 pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/vGym4
TreeBrowserPlugin/master ebbf178 George Clark: Item13656: Prepare for release...
[03:16]
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FoswikiBothttp://foswiki.org/Tasks/Item13656 [ Item13656: Update TreeBrowserPlugin for Foswiki 2.0, and recent perls ] [03:16]
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JulianLevensjast: This is looming large: http://foswiki.org/Community/FoswikiCamp2015Autumn [11:47]
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JulianLevensWould you like to change the IRC topic? [11:57]
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Lynnwood__Wow. Foswiki facebook page got 1000 new views this morning. That's a significant spike. [13:20]
gac410sourceforge downloads seem to tick along at around 300 per week. Pretty consistent going back to 2.0 release.
Now we just need to attract a few more developers to help with refreshing our extensions, etc.
[13:24]
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[13:25]
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gac410MichaelDaum: Regarding Copyright in the extension topic. When it's missing, would you recommend copying it from the ....Plugin.pm module? Or just leaving it empty. [13:43]
MichaelDaumleave it empty [13:44]
gac410okay. [13:44]
MichaelDaumif the automatic form creator isnt able to figure out the copyright...then dont use any default as thats a very sensible property of an extension [13:44]
gac410Right. I'll remove the default, that's easy enough. But when maintaining an extension, should the copyright be transferred manually at some point for consistency? [13:45]
MichaelDaumyes
too bad the original txt file isn't upgraded. instead the package builder does so with a copy on the fly :(
[13:46]
gac410y. It also inserts a default License of GPL if not specified. [13:47]
MichaelDaumbad as well
I will have to review all extensions that I maintain and that have recently been uploaded for conflicting copyright information
[13:47]
JulianLevensI'm developing a script to scan all extensions and highlight possible issues [13:51]
gac410The code that migrates the form is in https://github.com/foswiki/distro/blob/master/BuildContrib/lib/Foswiki/Contrib/BuildContrib/Targets/stage.pm
pretty straight forward.
The regex still needs some tuning, it probably falls over on multi-line table entries as well | copyright | blah<br/>\ (newline) blah ... |
[13:51]
JulianLevensRight now I'm focusing on those identified by Extensions/JsonReport as they're the ones that Foswiki users see in Confgure [13:53]
gac410I added a warning when non-ascii characters are encountered. I wonder if it also ought to warn if after form processing, certain important fields are missing - License, Copyright, Authors ...
JulianLevens: The "Compatibility" field is a big issue. CDot changed it from a text field to a checkbox. So all the old freeform compat information gets lost.
He was trying to make it automated. but if we tried to filter the list of extensions as any marked compatible with 2.0, it would be a pretty short list :)
[13:54]
JulianLevensYes I saw that and I've been thinking about how to make extensions available on a Release basis [13:56]
One option would be to assume that an extension marked 1.x is *assumed* to be ok for 1.x+ albeit is has to marked as cautionary in some way
Once, someone properly verifies an extension is can formally be marked as ok for 2.0 (or whatever)
[14:01]
gac410You would need a trinary then. Compatible, Not compatible, and not yet verified. [14:04]
JulianLevensy, and it's a lot of work to keep verifying. We may need to assume OK and have some way of marking as not OK (and have a matching urgent Task) [14:11]
gac410Y, a negative assertion might be more useful than the current positive assertion.
Item13666 .... I have no idea what's behind that one. strange.
[14:15]
FoswikiBothttp://foswiki.org/Tasks/Item13666 [ Item13666: Links wihin double square brackets are broken in my installation ] [14:15]
gac410I wonder if the LinkProtocolPattern got corrupted somehow [14:18]
Lavrgac410 just tried the Item13666 on my git pseudo and I do not see any issue at all. [14:25]
gac410right, I'm sure this would have been reported all over. All I can think of is it's not recognizing http:// as a link. I
So it's trying to use it as a wikiword
yup... That recreates the problem. Remove http from the LinkProtocolPattern configuration.
[14:26]
LavrMaybe the bulk_copy did something nasty. Are the [ and ] kept or turned into HTML entities for him. I have never converted anything [14:29]
gac410Hm no then it would probably just be plain text. i was thinking about that. It does get forced to be a link, just not http. [14:29]
LavrBut I guess he also tried to type in the links after the conversion
I also tried with Wysiwyg and it saves fine on my Iso site. I plan to try a conversion and run UTF soon to see what problems I run into
[14:29]
gac410okay. we'll be waiting for the fireworks :D
I'm going to jinx us now with this statement. But considering 400 downloads/week since July 1st, the incoming bug report volume is remarkably low ...
I really want to get 2.0.2 out, but CDot still has EditRow issues to deal with. That extension is mostly beyond my comprehension :D
[14:30]
LavrYeah. That one is nasty to understand how it works. [14:35]
gac410Really the whole |table| %TABLE% %EDITTABLE% ... mess is in need of a redesign. Rendering split between core + 2 extensions :P [14:36]
LavrWhat drive the need to force UTF8 for Func::saveFile?
That Func call is used by plugins to save files in the workarea. Not to save attachments or topics
[14:38]
gac410No idea. That's part of Crawford's work. Maybe just across-the-board encoding at boundaries Might be simply an overshoot of the changes.
There seems to be consistent opinion that that part should be reverted. The question will be is if we change it, how does that impact anything written since 2.0
Needs some consideration for the release notes for sure.
I think that maybe needs to be a blocker for 2.0.2 to get it resolved quickly.
[14:39]
LavrWhen you look at that Func call then it does not at all call any Foswiki code. It is a selfcontained sub using plain perl.
gac410 I would not consider the Func:saveFile a release blocker. But worth finding a better solution for.
[14:41]
gac410Because of noise level in tasks, I've been using urgent just to get tasks into the queue for consideration.
ie my "next release" wish list.
[14:42]
LavrIf I look at the plugins I use that use the func call then it is AttachContentPlugin and DirectedGraphPlugin that uses the call.
And here in Moto the AttachContentPlugin was used in 3 topics. All test topics. All pure ASCII saved. So it is DirectedGraphPlugin that I need to look at
[14:43]
gac410hm I can test DGP as well. Also need to consider the "readFile" if any. It should "reverse" whatever encoding was done in save. [14:45]
LavrIn DirectedGraphPlugin the saveFile is used to save a .dot file which is then sent to the binary that generates the charts. So the question is if this .dot file is harmed by being UTF'ed. My guess is that it makes no difference. [14:46]
gac410Hm So the question would be ... what happens if the dot graph contains unicode nodes. [14:46]
LavrSo it is probably mainly the reporter that has a plugin that assumed saving RAW. Maybe he saves a binary that gets molested [14:46]
gac410I'll bet without utf8 encoding, you'll get wide character in print errors
The text string extracted from the topic will be unicode characters, possibly multi-byte. Something needs to convert that to bytes for the external world I'd guess.
if saveFile will write raw, then DGP needs a "if $Foswiki::UNICODE" then encode the string on save.... I think. :(
[14:47]
FoswikiBothttp://trunk.foswiki.org/System/PerlDoc?module=Foswiki::UNICODE [14:49]
Lavrit seems the Macro link in System web is no longer the nice list of Macros. I think we missed a point of that link when it was changed to a document only. It was an nice quick reference to get the syntax for a Macro
And MacrosQuickReference which does what I want does not find half the VarTopics. It only finds the built-in macros
[14:56]
gac410Lavr, On current 2.0.1 w/ DGP, if you pass a URL=http://mywiki.com/Sandbox/AśčÁŠŤśěž ... it is badly broken. :( No crash, but not a usable url. [14:57]
LavrI have never tried a none ASCII topic name in 1.1.9 even.
I will raise an Item for this.
[14:59]
gac410That was the bulk of the 2.0 unicode work. Making sure unicode was usable in topic names, attachment names, and topic text. including wikiword linking, etc.
It's like 99% there.
The issue with DGP, is will it support unicode directly, when used external to Foswiki, or does the old code have limitations.
[15:01]
Lavr, If you attempt to save topic text containing unicode from Func::saveFile, it fails with Wide character in print errors, unless the utf8 encoding is specified.
So if saveFile is intended to be a transparent save, then extensions using it will have to implement the conversion from unicode to utf8 before calling saveFile
DGP is still not working with utf-8, but I think that's a different issue.
[15:14]
LavrWhy is %TOC% ignoring heading 1?
ah. A setting in WebPreferences in System web. That will be fun for all the plugin authors
[15:21]
gac410no idea. Doesn't it need explicit !! to ignore it?
Okay. "dot" command supports utf8 just fine. So dgp is not compatible with utf8 for some reason.
[15:22]
LavrSomeone has added 3 TOC setting to the System WebPreferences assuming that all Plugin docu can live with that??!! [15:23]
gac410git blame claims MichaelDaum_ for that change. [15:26]
andreliHello. I'm fighting to get 1.1 data to run on Foswiki 2.0.
Currently I struggle with TwistyPlugin.
[15:30]
gac410TwistyPlugin on 2.0 needs latest jquery versions. If you migrated your LocalSite.cfg, make sure that the jquery version is updated.
in the config settings
[15:31]
andreliI let LocalSite.cfg be created by configure from scratch.
So, I guess I have all the latest settings.
[15:32]
gac410Is twisty working in other system topics? editor help, etc? [15:33]
andreliNo, not even an System.TwistyPlugin
Oh. Seems to be a problem with the skins.
[15:34]
gac410Okay. hm. when I've seen it broken globally, it was often the jquery version, ... ah or skin :D [15:35]
andreliYeah, it's skin.
System.TwistyPlugin?skin=pattern works
[15:36]
gac410Are you using a local skin? [15:36]
andreliWe were introducing a lot a small modifications to pattern and prepend our skin pattern [15:37]
gac410Arthur made a lot of pattern changes, before he left. So those sorts of overrides will need some effort. Change to NatEdit also made skin changes. lots of little things. [15:38]
LavrThe only problem with the MacroQuickReference topic seems to be that it assumes the parent of a Var topic is Macros. If I remove that I get all the Var Topics listed and it looks quite OK with my selection of plugs [15:39]
gac410had to deal with that for RevCommentPlugin compatibility as well. [15:39]
andreliI start to realize. [15:40]
gac410The issue there is that someone created VarXXX topics for lots of non-macro topics. Crawford tried to delete a bunch of them, otherwise it gets confusing expecting settings to behave as macros.
gac410 wonders if we ought to have a SetXXXX topic faimly for settings that are not macros.
[15:40]
LavrThe eternal skin issue is the reason why I have ALWAYS chosen to run a near unmodified Pattern skin. I only tailor the WebTopBar to get our logo and colours. And I tailor the link style for create new topics.
I'd rather have a setting or two included too many than not having any plugin var Topics listed. It removes the whole purpose of having plugin var topics if they do not get listed.
[15:41]
gac410We *should* only make big skin changes in major releases. We ought to be stable certainly across Patch and preferably across minor releases.
Lavr, yeah. We should be adding Macros as the parent of VarXXX topics from extensions too. Though one could argue that parent should be the extension topic itself :(
[15:43]
LavrOn my installation I do not see any none Macro macros listed after I removed the parent condition from the SEARCH so that is what I consider checking in as a fix. And then there should be a link back to the Macros at the top. I really think the Quick reference needs to be on the WebLeftBar of System. I use it all the time. And I see my users doing the same (the power users that use Macros). [15:47]
gac410I have no objection. [15:49]
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GithubBot[distro] KennethLavrsen pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/vGHaB
distro/master 83c683f KennethLavrsen: Item13669: Macros topic has is no longer a good reference for a quick lookup of macro syntax...
[16:09]
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FoswikiBothttp://foswiki.org/Tasks/Item13669 [ Item13669: Macros topic has is no longer a good reference for a quick lookup of macro syntax ] [16:09]
LavrWhere is WebLeftBar in System web? [16:12]
gac410I think it's WebLeftBarExample or something like that.
So if you create a local WebLeftBar, it doesn't update a distribution topioc.
[16:12]
LavrAh. OK. Makes sense
I think I add the MacrosQuickReference instead of replacing the Macros link. Beginners will also need to look up syntax and the top to bottom, inside out rule etc.
And then I will fix the Author field and other topic garbage I just checked in
[16:13]
gac410re defaults. The 1.x 2.x break between major releases was the time to change defaults. Since many topics need to be updated for 2.0 anyway, probably better to keep the modern defaults and update the extensions [16:17]
LavrWhich defaults are you thinking about?
TOC?
[16:20]
gac410The TOC ... yes [16:20]
LavrNo. The problem is that a plugin author that wants to add a TOC will wonder - like I did - why header 1 is ignored. It is bad to setup a trap like this and it can be avoided. I bet it is 2 or 3 topics in System web that really takes advantage of the setting [16:22]
gac410MichaelDaum_: can you explain why the TOC defaults were changed for the System web? [16:23]
GithubBot[distro] KennethLavrsen pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/vGHiZ
distro/master c857166 KennethLavrsen: Item13669: Macros topic has is no longer a good reference for a quick lookup of macro syntax...
[16:26]
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LavrI think the best is to look quickly through the System topics and look for the combination of TOC and ---+ without the trailing !!
So I do that now. I bet it is 2 or 3 topics that are the issue
Reference manual is my first bet
[16:28]
There are 47 TOCs in System web. And about half just needs a !! on the first headline and then we can drop the default skipping of level 1. Maybe I will do that in some boring conference call the next days [16:33]
I will look at the !! thing. I have put myself as working on it. If anyone has any words of warning, add it to the Item. And it is not important at all for 2.0.2.
I also changed it to Low priority
The Macros thing is checked in a Waiting For Release
End of my day. See you all
[16:41]
gac410I'm on hold on 2.0.2 until CDot fixes the last of the EditRow issues. ... unless you thing it shoudl go anyway
see ya. goodnight.
[16:42]
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